A Borden Descendent

dalandwebb · Post by **dalandwebb** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:16 am

My grandmother was a Borden: Ida, daughter of Charles Frederick Borden. Even though a Borden and a contemporary of Lizzie's they were at least five generations apart from a common ancestor. Have you ever seen a directory of families in Fall River from 1891? Many, many Bordens. Anyone with the family name of Borden has roots in Fall River.
I shall be checking back in later to see if I can find out more about the property that Charles F. owned in Fall River. I have some period photos of one of his houses which I hope to put on this site.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:48 am

This is the house that Charles F. Borden lived in during the time of the murders of the Bordens on Second Street.

I have worked in this house many, many times, though not in past 10 years or so. It has long been butchered inside and chopped up into apartments. It has never come back and I'm afraid that it is to far gone to ever return.

One can easily imagine what it must have looked like in it's peak. I can only imagine that it had a wonderful majestic front door and sweeping porch. To see it in its prime would be a pleasure; to see it today is sad.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:09 pm

Yes, to speak about the architecture of it all.............

The neat home you see below is the A. Lincoln home, just a couple of lots over from the Andrew Jennings home on June Street, the other of the Borden (Charles F.) home.

You can see the similarities between the two buildings and One can imagine how beautiful the Charles Borden home must have been at one time. Though the Lincoln home is also broken up into apartments, it was done in good taste. And, as you can see, it has been kept up very nicely.

Looking at the Lincoln home you can get an idea for what the facade of the Borden house looked like before some one shaved it off cleaner than old man Andrew Borden' face.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:27 pm

Yes, what the heck. While we are at it, why not post the James Eddy house which is another huge Victorian which sits between the Jennings home and the Lincoln homes, also on June Street.

Though somewhat similar, but probably only in size, it is huge but beautiful.

Such places are much bigger than Maplecorft and are nearing mansion size, but still just big homes.

None-the-less, a pleasure to look at and a stimulus for the mind as to how some of these people must have lived.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 3:13 pm

Wow, now that's a house! Beautiful.

Thanks for the photo.

dalandwebb · Post by **dalandwebb** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 4:15 pm

Thanks for the reply. Is that address of the Charles F. Borden house still 192 Lincoln? I have two other sites that he also lived at one of them on June St. I will post some pictures as soon as I get a chance.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 9:50 pm

Yes dalandwebb: The house I posted above is on Maple Street. This was posted as the house where Charles F Borden was living in in 1892

I'm not sure and would need to do some research to find any other homes which he may have lived in.

The house you speak of on Lincoln Ave is known as the Edward H. Thomas house and was built in 1896. I am assuming there is only one Charles F. Borden.

Below is 192 Lincoln Ave. and how it appears today.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 4:29 am

Hi!
Actually, I think there are Bordens also who are Connecticut, New York and Rhode Island, related in the original line from Great Britain.

I have a Charles F. Borden in the Earl genealogy (1877).

Thomas Borden119
^
Joseph125
^
Joseph143
^
Charles F.162

Thomas was an uncle of Abraham Borden.
He married Mary Hathaway.
His son Joseph125 married Hannah Borden, daughter of Stephen, 1800.

This Thomas119"inherited the homestead of his father, the saw and grist mills destroyed by the British and afterwards rebuilt, together with a portion of his outlying lands. The property thus inherited had been handed down from generation to generation from the first Richard of Tiverton, and so continued in the family until the formation of the Fall River Iron Works Company in 1821, when the portion contiguous to the lower part of the Fall River stream was sold to that corporation. The management, however, still continued in the family of Mr. Borden. He died Nov. 29, 1831, aged 81 years. His wife Mary, died Feb. 18th, aged 67 years."

The Genealogy of the Borden Family Living in Fall River and Vacinity, 1876, extract from Fall River and Its Industries, Atlantic Publishing ans Engraving Co., New York, Benjamin Earl & Son, Fall River, Mass., 1877.

Is this your guy?

dalandwebb · Post by **dalandwebb** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 11:42 am

To Kat. Wow, you must be considered on eo the experts on this site. Yes, that is the correct Charles F. Borden: b. 29 Sept 1854 d. 12 Jan 1905 (the year before my dad was born) m. Annie Lincoln Remington 8 June 1880 and my grandmother, Ida Eastman Borden was born 15 Sept 1881 and died 4 Jan 1915 as a result of giving birth to my uncle, Borden Webb (whose son, Borden D. Webb is an attorney in Sacramento, CA). The common ancestor to this line of the Bordens and the line Lizzie is in was Thomas Borden: b.1697 d. 1740 and your Joseph's et al are correct.
There may have been several Bordens of England who emmigrated to the U.S. much later but, for the most part, a substantial number of descendants eminate from Richard Borden (1596-1671) who was a Quaker from Hedcorn, Kent, England, and ended up in Portsmouth, R.I.
The book you give reference to is one that my dad always wanted to acquire. several years ago, I saw that it had been reprinted but I have yet to get it. Another great volume is "Representative Men and Old Families of Southeastern Massachusetts" which can be downloaded off of the internet. Looking forward to other exchanges between us.

dalandwebb · Post by **dalandwebb** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 12:19 pm

This picture of what is known in our family as "The Charles F. Borden home" was taken in 1909. The reason I know this to be so is because in the picture is my aunt Anne Webb, my Dad (George D. Webb) and in the baby carriage would be my aunt Peg (Charlotte Webb) a brand new baby in 1909.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:13 pm

Wow!! That is some house! Thanks for the picture!

Yes your Borden line is of the BIG Bordens- I've just looked at it again before logging on here, and am going back to the original. Thanks now for the extra dates. This is all Earl. (Is Rep Men wholly downloadable or only partly?- I do have the "Borden" chapters from there tho- I was going to go there next.)

Richard1
^
John5 (fourth child of Richard)
^
Richard95 (first child and son of John)*
^
Thomas103 (third child of Richard)
^
Richard114 (first born and son of Thomas)
^
Thomas119 (first born and son of Richard)
^
Joseph125 (first born and son of Thomas)
^
Joseph143 (sixth of six children-3 bros 2 sist)
^
Charles F. (eighth of nine children-if married: after 1867)

I give birth order because the first born son usually gets the good stuff by will.

*This is the Borden who married a girl named Innocent and the Cornells claim her as theirs and propagate the story of the Rebecca Cornell murder being in their line.
Do you have a family tale about this claim? The Borden's have a tie to the Wardells and an Innocent Wardell married thru the Borden line.[edit here for clarification: Rebecca Cornell is in th Cornell line of course- what they claim tho is that Lizzie is in their line as another murderer thru this Innocent person.]

Do you have Hattie Borden Weld's genealogy?

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:58 pm

Yes, the house you know as the Charles F. Borden house was built by and is indeed the Edward H. Thomas House. It was built in 1896.

In 1896, the year the Edward H. Thomas House was built on Lincoln Ave., Charles F. Borden was living on the corner of Maple and Winter at 530 Maple Street, the house in the photo posted above.

Of course, to you and your family, it will always be known as the Chales F. Borden home and rightfully so.

Great old photo. So nice to see the old place as it looked when it was all original.

As for the house on Maple street, it is sad to see it in such condition. Such are the results when you have a slum lord who does not care, because he lives out of town and just cares about lining his pockets.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:52 pm

The 1896 Fall River City Directory has Charles F. Borden, same description of home location, but gives the house number finally as 530 Maple, cor Winter.

Ooops! Duplicated post- sorry!

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:00 pm

Hey, MB! I think you have the 1926 City Directory? Have you looked in there?

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:35 pm

I don't know from whence I got this photo. I believe it was from a book on sale on EBay some time ago.

Unless these old eyes mistake me the writing under the house on top says "Chas F. Borden June St."

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 12:56 am

Really cool pics Har! Thanks!

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 1:23 am

YES, GREAT FIND HARRY

That was taken out of the 1885 fall river Atlas.

And you want to hear something funny? I have worked in that house.

That house is well kept and has always been. When doing my house over I took a picture of the peak of that house (the ginger bread) because I wanted to duplicate it on my building, but it would take up to much of my time to build along with the expense.

That is known as the Borden-Wetherell House. (must be Charles F.)

It was built in 1882 probably by Charles F. Borden. By 1892 Borden no longer lived there and had moved to 530 Maple Street to a much larger home. Fall river directory show Orin Wetherell living at 392 June Street by 1892.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 1:30 am

Yes, Below is the Borden-Wetherell House which was built in 1882 at 392 June Street and which is listed in the 1885 Fall River Atlas.

One is an image taken from the 1885 Atlas in my library and the other is the Borden-Wetherell house as it looks today.

Since the house is listed in the 1885 Atlas and since it was built in 1882 we can safely assume it was built by Charles F. Borden not Orin Wetherell.

As it stands today, this is a great example of a vintage Victorian which has always been well kept.

As you can see, the original porch was removed and a sweeping larger one was installed sometime after 1885.

Great find Harry.

Nadzieja · Post by **Nadzieja** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 4:36 am

First, welcome to the Forum, delandwebb. You'll be amazed at the knowledge on this site.
Wow, Harry what great pictures. I love looking at the houses whenever anyone posts. The houses that are kept up look so beautiful. I would love to get a peek on the inside of some of them.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 7:35 am

MB deserves the credit for the great photos.

Some of the houses look like they came off a Currier & Ives print. Cool.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Mon Dec 22, 2008 10:39 pm

Yes Kat:

I have the 26 and the 21 directories. I looked in the 1921 directory and there is a Charles F. Borden in it but it is not the same gentlemen. This fellow boards at 111 Rodman Street, which is a 6 unit apartment building.

dalandwebb · Post by **dalandwebb** » Tue Dec 23, 2008 12:37 am

Thank you, one and all. You are very helpful and of great interest.
Harry, That is the picture that I was about to post. Evidentally Charles F. moved around quite a bit in the same neighborhood and has at least 4 different addresses there. I have to check with my brother for the 4th address plus the home he lived in as a tenant when he started working for his father-in-law, Robert Knight Remington, who owned the house.
Kat, I do have a tale of Innocent. For a long time, for some reason, I thought she was a Wardell. But my brother straightened me out on that recently. I shall send you, word for word, what my father had in his files on the story of Innocent. That text that I mentioned also has some good info on the Hathaways. I don't know how divergent we can get on this site.
These are all relatives of the Borden family, but I would like to relate to you some of the work my father did over some 30 years and I am trying to find a connection with possible property at Westport Beach, MA, which was a great recreational site for residents of Fall River.
Late now. I may wait and get back to you after the New Year.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Tue Dec 23, 2008 3:51 am

Thanks. Hmmm... I have several Wardells marrying Bordens, in New York or New Jersey (I'll find my notes on that). I'll be very interested in proof of a Cornell connection- I've not believed it yet. Thanks- looking forward to that.
Happy Christmas and New Year!

xyjw · Post by **xyjw** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 10:40 am

Is there a book of Borden descendants? Or a cd that can be purchased?

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Fri Apr 03, 2009 1:31 am

Sorry, I've only just seen your query!

You can buy from the FRHistorical Society authors Peck&Earl that has several prominent genealogies: Fall River and Its Industries- $38 and shipping (tax?).
If you are a member of that organization there is a discount.
They also have, or had, a pamphlet that is the Borden genealogy broken out.

http://www.lizzieborden.org/category_list.asp?cat=Books

xyjw · Post by **xyjw** » Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:44 am

Thank You so much Kat! My family name is a prominent one in the southeastern MA. area and one of the Borden jurors may be an ancestor. I did not know that FRHS had a publication of these names. Thanks for the reply!

1bigsteve · Post by **1bigsteve** » Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:30 pm

Seeing these old photographs makes me feel like I'm stepping back in time. I love old houses. Thank you for sharing.

-1bigsteve (o:

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 5:29 pm

It's a History of Fall River with these genealogies at the back:

Durfee
Borden
Anthony*
Davol
Chase

*The Anthony portion is just a one-page lineage

Did you tell us your family name?

Lizzie Borden Society Forum

A Borden Descendent

A Borden Descendent

Charles F. Borden house

Charles F. Borden

Charles F. Borden house(s)