If Lizzie...

[MysteryReader]

If Lizzie did kill Abby to keep the money from going to her and going to Emma and herself, what reason did she have for killing her father? From all accounts, she did get along with him, even though she might not have enjoyed not having some of the finer things in life, such as a working indoor bathroom. I welcome your ideas and thoughts, please.

[Curryong]

In my view, and of course, it's only my opinion, I think her primary motive in killing Andrew was in order that he did not find out what she had done, ie murdered his wife. I don't know whether Andrew understood Lizzie very well (probably not, as he did not get rid of the horrible atmosphere in the Borden home by buying her and Emma a place of their own, for instance, something he could easily have done.)

However, he certainly KNEW her well, as you do when you live with someone for decades. He had already been through the affair of the daylight robbery at their home the year before. We don't know that he suspected Lizzie of that, but all his behaviour afterwards screams to me that he did.

If he had survived Abby's murder he may not have allowed himself to suspect his daughter straight away. In my opinion however, after great thought, and knowing she had been the only (known) person with Abby at the time, inside the home, he would have come to that conclusion.

I don't think he would have allowed her to be arrested if he could help it. I think he would have had a quiet word with medical and other authorities and it would have been incarceration in a quiet, discreet private asylum for Lizzie. I think Lizzie knew all this and as she wanted a nice independent life, with her own money to do what she liked with, Father had to go.

[twinsrwe]

I agree, Curryong. I'm sure Andrew would have put two and two together very quickly and knew without a doubt that it had to have been Lizzie who killed his beloved wife, then he could have easily disinherited Lizzie, and she would have gotten not a penny of his money.

BTW, Andrew did buy a house for Emma and Lizzie after they threw a fit when he purchased a house for Abby's half-sister, but they chose to rent it out instead of making it into a home for the two of them to live in. When they couldn't handle the place, Andrew bought it back from them.

[Curryong]

Thanks for reminding me of that property, twinsrwe. However, though I may be wrong, I thought that house was one of Andrew's rental properties, and he gifted it to Emma and Lizzie to placate their so hurt feelings, but also perhaps (and this is only my speculation) to see how they would handle being landlords; see what sort of business nous they had, perhaps.
As they didn't seem to have any, (nous, I mean) he then bought the property back. I suppose they could have used it as their home, but it probably wasn't in Lizzie's preferred area L.O.L !

[Aamartin]

Lizzie may have transplanted her anger about living below her 'station' from Andrew to Abby. She may have fooled herself into believing Abby influenced Andrew in some way and once she was gone Andrew would happily move and get modern things in the home.

[MysteryReader]

Thanks, y'all! You've given me more to think about and research.

[Curryong]

Yes, Aa, she might have suffered from that delusion, but it would still have left her and her sister living in the home of a rigid old person who held all the power (ie money) in his hands. Years and years of $4:00 weekly allowances to look forward to!

[PossumPie]

I think Lizzie hated the situation (meaning Abby being given things AND Andrew's control over the money). It isn't a stretch to say Killing them both solves all her problems more than leaving her father to deduce who did it. Remember, He quietly dropped charges when he figured out it was Lizzie who stole the items from Mrs. Borden's room.

[Curryong]

Andrew's death certainly did solve all Lizzie's problems.

I didn't mean in my above posts that I think that Lizzie would have consciously 'allowed' her father to live and survive Abby, just that circumstances that Thursday morning could have prevented her murdering him. Things could then have worked out very differently.

Suppose, for instance, John Morse had returned, moments after Andrew, and insisted on sitting talking to his host in the sittingroom for half an hour. Uncle John was capable of it. He was quite a chatterbox. He then goes up to his temporary bedroom for something and Voila! Abby is found. (Bridget would be downstairs by then too.)

Lizzie would have had it, quite frankly, if that scenario had developed. There certainly couldn't be any further attempt to stage 'a mad intruder' incursion. It would be this kind of state of affairs I'm talking about when I imagine Andrew surviving and his reactions to his wife's death.

[twinsrwe]

Thanks for reminding me of that property, twinsrwe. However, though I may be wrong, I thought that house was one of Andrew's rental properties, and he gifted it to Emma and Lizzie to placate their so hurt feelings, but also perhaps (and this is only my speculation) to see how they would handle being landlords; see what sort of business nous they had, perhaps.
As they didn't seem to have any, (nous, I mean) he then bought the property back. I suppose they could have used it as their home, but it probably wasn't in Lizzie's preferred area L.O.L !

You’re welcome, Curryong. The house which Andrew deeded to Lizzie and Emma in October of 1887, was actually the old family homestead on Ferry Street; it was the same house Lizzie was born in. In July of 1892, Andrew bought the Ferry Street house back from 'the girls' for $5,000. Emma and Lizzie each received $2,500; that was a huge amount of money in 1892. You are correct; the house was used as a rental property.

Poor Andrew has been unfairly tagged as a stingy tight-wad, but in reality he actually bought the Ferry Street property twice!!! He bought 1/2 of it from his father for a life pension, then he bought the other 1/2 from his sister, and then he generously gave the house to his daughters, which he then bought back from them!!! I think Andrew went above and beyond in his attempt to satisfy the women in his family, which failed miserably. To top it all off, Lizzie and Emma inherited the Ferry Street house after Abby and Andrew were kill, and then sold it, again, for a tidy little profit.

Emma and Lizzie could have graciously accepted the house from their father, and made it their home. Unfortunately, their greed overpowered their need for peace in the family.

[Curryong]

Agreed, twinsrwe, on all points! Greed is the key to the Borden case for sure, and Andrew has been unfairly targeted. He just tried to help his wife's sister and placate his difficult (especially Lizzie) and avaricious 'girls'.