Lizzie Borden Society Forum

Those metallic memorials (Friends of Oak Grove blog) are sometimes called White Bronze but they are actually zinc. Sometimes they looks whitish to light blue to darker blue. They could be ordered from a Sears and Roebuck catalogue years ago and they really hold their shape and engraving well as they are basically embossed or repousee metal. The only time they have problems is when people who try to fix them try using cement to fill gaps. The other downside is that top motifs like urns can snap off. I am just putting up a slide presentation on an example of that.

The Friends group is really taking off thanks to Mike McKeane, a FR resident and architect who was a former FR preservation society president. In fact I was allowed to finally put a membership form up just today as it got approval. It's exciting to see this taking off. In fact, I have been neglecting the Painted Ladies lately because the Oak Grove thing has been hopping! Find A Grave has also given me some exposure and support and now 80-100 people a day are visiting the Bordens and Oak Grove. Maybe someone else might sponsor a flower or a tree! We got two trees last week.

There are more photos of the renovations on Second Street here
http://sanctaflora.wordpress.com/catego ... rovements/
Just scroll down a little.

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Er,. . . actually I like drab MB. My own house is two tones of slate gray- which I believe was the color Lizzie chose for Maplecroft to cover the verdi-gris and tan (which sounded pretty awful). The gray-olive-brown in two tones of drab selected probably by Abby or Andrew was probably low-maintenance. I prefer darker colors on the faschia and other trim rather than a dark main color with lighter trim-it's richer looking and really picks out the architectural detail and defines the lines of the building.
My comment about the house now is that it is pretty, yes- but entirely TOO green in the main color. I had dragged chips to the URI lab and stuck them under a forensics microscope, then matched chips against what I saw. The current trim at #92 is pretty darn close, but the color on the body of the house is too green. Still, it is a mercy the place was properly sanded, sealed and painted and is good for another few years. The project this summer is to get that side screen door back on.

Not to mention, drab, gray, olive, and brown are all great backround neutrals for vines and flowers. I think the red rose on the south side and the wisteria at the Bordens 1892 must have look fine against the drab background. I noticed your original color scheme of brown shingling, MB, which is now different on the front facade, and wondered if the rest of the house is "going lighter".

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Oh, no offense was taken. I just like rambling on about colors, houses, architecture, and such. Donald and LeeAnn had asked me- and Len also about colors when the painting was commencing at #92- and we gave our best opinions and picked out the color chips. Still, the house and barn are too green. But, there it is- and it sure looks a heck of a lot better than it did when the old press was attached. The light tan that had been on it was awful when it aged, it had so much pink in it. I saved a shingle and some trim during the renovation from both #92 and Maplecroft. Both have layers and layers of paint .
I am glad you visit the Painted Ladies blog MB- it is not a popular one, but I plan to keep it going because I have such a good time doing it. I am working on the house on Prospect Street right next to the Dana Brayton House. You know, the gorgeous Italianate one which was painted up and gilded last October. I looked for a plaque or something on it last week with no luck. I have to dig out some more info on it. I count on your help with some of these Painted Ladies

I went further back into this subject and stopped cold when I saw the color photo of Shelley on the floor. I can't believe how different color in a picture can change emotion. Richard summed it up so well. We can't forget what a horrible crime this was and that people were brutally murdered. I saw something as I was flipping through the channels the other night, it had to be part of some horror movie, but a woman was killing someone with an axe. The thing that got me was the sound. The sound of the axe hitting & going through whatever they used to simulate a person. The scream & moan were chilling. All I could think of at that moment was Abby and the fear she must have felt even if it was only for a second. If she actually turned and saw the face of her killer what went through her mind. Then what about Andrew, if he opened his eyes to see what was about to hit him. I hope for his sake he was asleep & didn't know it was coming. Sometimes we forget they were real and alive because it happend so long ago. However I think the group treats this case and this house with much respect. What I wouldn't give to speak with Lizzie even for a few minutes!!!!!

Nice weekend to be in Fall River- cold but sunny. We were talking about the Maplecroft library books this week somewhere here in the forum so I asked about them. Yes, the very valuable initialed books are locked away, but some which came from Lizzie's library are in the photo below. Sadly two which had her Maplecroft bookplate and LAB were stolen before the turnover of ownership.

Last night we had 8 guests, all young couples of thirty-something and the couple below, well, you can see how much he looked like Sylvester Stallone- so I asked for a photo!

You can see the spot waiting for the new Lizzie photo in the sitting room!

LeeAnn has put up a nice copy of the Whitehead property transfer to Abby in the Bordens' bedroom

The infamous well which figured in the Mrs. Ladowick Borden homicide-suicide is where you see the black and white fence at the back of the Kelly house yard
over toward the driveway corner.
People have taken to leaving Andrew some loot and cigars to keep from getting haunted. These are on his desk in the bedroom

Here's my parting shot while waiting for the light on Bedford Street of the Academy building, then's its home across the Braga Bridge. It was a great day for photography and I managed nearly 200 Painted Lady photos.

Big seance at the house tonight with a full house. Victorian tableturning has become the new Saturday night parlor entertainment! I haven't sat in on this YET. And that's all folks till next week!

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Are you pointing to the little yellow house behind, MB?

And Shell-there's another page to that land transfer- do you have it? If you need it, please ask.

Also I have a question: How has the well area been identified? And is that the same as a "cistern?"

Thank you for the pictures!

As always, some great pics Shelley. Have to say I haven't heard of the Mrs. Ladowick Borden homicide-suicide. What was this about? Where can I get the story on it?

Len's book has the Ladowick Borden story, we have talked about it here too extensively. It all came out at Lizzie's trial when it was mentioned in the newspapers that the Borden wife in the house next door had thrown herself and 3 children down the well and all but the little girl died. She was mentioned as being grown up and a mother herself in the city in 1893. It was also determined by the Prosecution that hereditary insanity could not be used as a defense since that Mrs. Borden (maiden name Darling) was only a Borden by marriage. Len looked through old land records and found the approximate location of that ill-fated well. It's hard to beat Len's careful scholarship on most topics.

Re: the leaning tower o' books in the sitting room- that's what they look like at the end of the day when guests have pawed through. They change configuration daily. I do think bookends would be a plus. I am not sure if LeeAnn has page 2 of the land transfer. Mostly I think few guests stop to read the one page!

Yes, I LOVE that sweet little yellow Cape on Third Street. You can almost see the bones of a truly old house, even under the aluminum siding and other atrocities.

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Thanks Shelley, for sharing the photos! If I ever get there it will be like returning to a familiar place!!

Thanks so much for that- for that has always been my aim since I came here with photos in August of 2006- to bring Fall River, the house and the Borden story to people far away who might not get out this way. All of us at the house who do daily short tours, or the longer night tours hope to give a glimpse of the past to visitors who pass through. The Internet has been a great tool to extend that aim to audiences farther away. When I went to work for LeeAnn, she said "Consider this your second home"- and it has become so.

Nadzieja @ Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:26 am wrote:As always, some great pics Shelley. Have to say I haven't heard of the Mrs. Ladowick Borden homicide-suicide. What was this about? Where can I get the story on it?

Yes we have been discussing the drowned children through all the Forum incarnations- there's a blurb in Kent's Sourcebook, 1992, and a few of us have been looking for info ever since.

Here's a link to the more info dug up that finally fulfilled my dream of filling out the story:
viewtopic.php?t=2800

So Len found the cistern? Wow!

Kat @ Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:39 am wrote:So Len found the cistern? Wow!

That is amazing. I wonder if he found an old property map.

Great pix as always, Shelley.

Ice left much of the town coated in a shimmery crust this weekend and footing was treacherous. banister at #92


Addie Churchill's


View of St. Mary's at 8 am while the Mass bell tolled


Bright winter sun on the bed in Bridget's room

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Yes! I posted it in the Privy at 8 a.m. under MonsterQuest. It was QUITE an experience for us all. There are quite a few photos there as well.

The parlor has a new addition with a handmade pear candy dish, fashioned by new hire Sue. The big news this week was the for sale sign going up on the Kelly house next door with the attached hair salon. Spring flowers were in bloom although there is a chill in the air.

A few new photos have been added around the house-all in the dining room
Dr. Dolan in his jaunty car


Dr. Cheever


and Dr. Wood from Harvard medical School

I notice in the picture that Dr. Dolan's car is right hand drive. I wonder if it really was right hand drive or if the picture has been inverted.

I also notice that the car is parked on the left hand side of the street, which would be wrong unless the street was one way.

I can't make out the licence plate enough to see if the digits are backwards.

If Dr. Dolan had that car in 1892 he could have raced to the scene of the crime.

Good eye, Fargo!

Here's the photo reversed. Of course the name at the bottom is now reversed as well.

This may shed some light on the subject of right hand drive. I got the information below from Wikipedia Encyclopedia online.

**Early American motor vehicles were produced in RHD, following the practice established by horse-drawn buggies. This changed in the early years of the 20th century: Ford changed to LHD production in 1908, and Cadillac in 1916.**

The way I posted the photo on the previous page is correctly oriented. The license plate number is 5765.
Mostly I was thrilled to bits to see their faces, especially Dr. Dolan's.

I was going to mention too that many early motor cars were produced in England, who still have RHD.

It's been a cold cold winter in New England. Here's the Victorian way to keep out drafts at the house- portieres! They are also on the side door.
What else is new?

A shelf with two china figurines in the parlor.
Hilliard and Coughlin over the settee in the parlor along with the New Bedford Jury.

And a new mirror on the stairs.

A great time was had by all as the Borden house hosted an overnight Friday- Sat June 6-7 for 11 gifted and talented youngsters (aged 13) from New Hampshire who are working on a project recreating portions of Lizzie's trial. 8 young ladies and 3 clever fellows arrived at 4 on Friday with 9 teachers and mentors. I called Len immediately as he really shines with young student audiences and I must say I had the BEST evening of my 11 years at #92 with these great kids.
I was so impressed with their knowledge of the case and legal proceedings. We had a little Lizzie 101 in the sitting room with the children raising their hands to ask Professor Len questions, and afterward had an indepth tour of the house with students and teachers taking the parts of the major characters. Those students were one step ahead all the time and came up with GREAT slants. One young man mused for a moment then came up with the thought that maybe Uncle John had been romancing Bridget on the third floor during his stays up there and those two were in cahoots!
There was not one aspect of the case this group was not aware of- a stellar evening. Students left with treats and surprises from Len in the form of bookmarks and postcards. I left at midnight but the gang stayed overnight, looking forward to their jonnycakes. I dressed up for them as Abby Borden and the girls went upstairs to try on their own leg o' muttons later.

Gosh, we never had field trips like that when I was in school. Very cool!

What questions did the kids have? What did they find the most puzzling about the case?

Well they all focused in a lot on the trial since that was their project- and all knew about all the steps up to Grand Jury Trial. They asked about the locks on the doors, we discussed motive, opportunity, weapon, etc.- particularly MOTIVE. They were extremely interested in Eli Bence's evidence and why it was disallowed later. So I got my moment to shine holding forth on Bence.

One of the boys wondered about Lizzie and Nance O'Neil- I had to smile because at age 13, I had never heard of lesbianism before. Another child brought up the incest slant- so I was amazed how early kids are informed on topics which were largely unknown in my day at that age (when dinosaurs roamed the earth). Yes, Len and I looked at each other across the room with wide eyes for a moment!
We re-created the possible scenarios for each homicide, and opportunities for an intruder to gain access to the house. The kids were always one step ahead and sharp as tacks! But in the end we kept coming back to motive motive motive and was greed powerful enough for removing both of the elderly pair. I put forward the possibility that Abby was the victim and maybe Andrew was just at the wrong place at the wrong time and would have guessed the truth if the killer were Lizzie. They seemed to like that possibility as well. We also discussed the Simpson case and similarities.

All tended to find Lizzie's lack of alibi a little suspect -especially lame was the hayloft tale she spun. One child wanted to know if morphine in the dosage Lizzie took would account for her inquest discrepancies. I brought my students to Fall River for Lizzie trips but we never stayed at the house. The teachers were fantastic. Later they had some fun with the "ghostie" element and telling spooky tales. This was my third time with a large group of youngsters- we had a girl scout and a boy scout troup before . It's great to get young ideas on the case- very imaginative.

Wow, are you sure you were talking to kids!!! It's amazing how much they know today at such an early age. I feel like I was brought up in a closet & naive because I never would have thought of the things they did at there age.

Now that I have my scanner hooked up I can share pictures from my Fall River trip. I took this picture of Lizzie's dress on Oct 27th 2004. I never realized until after I had the film developed, that my reflection was in the mirror.

Yes, I did the same thing in the photo above- sometimes you even show up in picture glass or reflected in a silver tea tray!

Hmmmm? I don't see any numbers on that car?

The original may have been reversed? Unless Mr. Dolan drives on the othert side of the street.

Look There I am again in Andrew and Abby's room. I show up in the craziest places.

Thanks for the "Oldies But Goodies!"

You seem to have a gigantically bright ball of light following you around!

Shelley.........are those inside wooden shudder blinds in the Borden's bedroom original to the house?

No, alas, Home Depot.

LOL...... thank you for answering my question Shelley. I guess I was hoping that they were the originals.

The picture of the basement is neat to me The person in the picture is another guest that I became aquainted with that night. We were on the evening tour. I wanted to snap a few pictures of the basement. The rest of the tour party had gone upstairs and me and my friend were still hanging around in the basement talking about the case. About 3 seconds after I took this picture Dee called down the stairs for us to get up there so they could continue the tour. I did manage to get a couple other quick pictures though.

What is you can't see from this picture of the sitting room is that Lee ann is in the room. Lee ann was adjusting the cushions on Andrew's sofa when I was getting ready to take this picture from the parlor. As she did not want to get in the way of the picture, Lee ann went to the south side of the sitting room. This picture was taken at about an hour after check in time.

Bridget's room Oct 27th 2004. Kat, note the clothes hanger in the closet.

Ah HA! Did you remember that I accidentally pulled that down? I mean, I barely touched it! What a shock that was! I hastily put it back up again!

Yes, I remembered you mentioning about it coming down, although I don't remember which trip you said it was on. Was it the trip you had in Oct 2004 ?

I am showing 4 versions of the same picture I took of the guestroom from the stairs. That camera I used was never good for inside pictures taken from another room, it was too dim.

I'm just experimenting around to find out what can be done to try to fix pictures.

Twilight the movie invades even Lizzie's house this past week as a fan has her 14th Twilight birthday at midnight on the black sofa. Adoring Dad came with an Edward and Bella cake after the seance and then the talk turned to Edward Cullen and Rhode Island Vampires. What Would Lizzie Say?!

Well Fargo, it's funny you are putting your new *trys* up here!
I think your first one is the best version.
It's neat you are just getting to your photos!!

I had first been in that closet with Bill Pavao, March, 2004. That was the day the thing fell down. That was after filming that Discovery Channel video, waiting for Len to finish his spot.

We came back to Fall River in October, and the day after we arrived back in Florida the video was on TV.