Lizzie Borden Society Forum

It is hard for me to critique myself and the talk---I feel like it went well, but I can't see myself and have to trust that things are fine by the reaction of the audience. The reaction was positive so I feel pretty confident the crowd was pleased.

They had to get more chairs, they said, which means more people showed up than they expected. I brought postcards for The Hatchet and bookmarks I had professionally printed, and all those were grabbed up. I had a handout too, several pages long, with interesting facts and a bibliography and a list of all the openings of the documentaries.

I joked with Dennis that I was going to talk until midnight and did he mind, and when I finished at 9 he was pleased I didn't go as long as I said I would--ha ha! I was told 50 minutes, but I just had so much to say! And if you know me, you know I can't just keep it short----I adlib so much that it makes it longer. Kat says that is a good thing as it sounds conversational instead of rehearsed. I used the slides I created using Keynote to remind me what I was going to say so I didn't need notes.

I had added a lot of video to the show and the hall was so long and so filled that I think some in the very back couldn't hear as well as they wanted. Half way through the Reverend turned off the air conditioner as it was making noise. Then it really got hot! I was sweating and dripping, although Harry said he couldn't tell. The heat made one older lady fall asleep---it acted like a drug!

I really loved the response afterwards. Total strangers came up to me to share their stories. I met a woman whose grandfather used to visit the 7 churches in fall river every month (I think she said every month) and each time he came he would stop by to visit Lizzie. She would be working in her garden (can you imagine!!) and he would stop and chat. He told his family that she couldn't have killed her parents because she was so kind to him.

I met a man who was a college teacher and he wanted to say he enjoyed the entertaining way I did the talk and guessed my classes are fun for my students. I met a woman who used to work at Rollins College here in Winter Park, not 3 miles from my house! She is a nun who does mission work and now works with the homeless in Fall River. She recognized that I was from the central florida area from my bio.

Terence Duniho's widow, newly married, arrived with her groom! It was grand to see her again!! She looked so very happy and it made me glad to know she was carrying on with life and had found happiness again.

Then there were friends---Mark A., Kash, Doug and Marilou, Len, Bill, Shelley, Michael, Dennis, and I met Cynthia from this forum for the first time. It was truly grand to be in a room with all these lovely people.

Fall River is a very interesting place. On one hand it is very proud of its past, eager to share its history and hospitality. On the other, it is a bit underwhelmed by Lizzie and I think some prefer not to discuss the case or its possible implications. I suppose that would be the same anywhere, but since I am not from there, it is a division that always strikes me the same hard way.

I know people have "stuff" in their attics, and yet, they are not prone to revealing their cache of Lizzie items because it will connect them somehow to something unspeakable. I think we know about 1/10th of what is to be known. And until the families of Fall River reveal their collections, if they ever do, we won't know much more. I mean there is only so much we can gather from newspapers and the same old photographs.

Ah! Good post! And good point too.
I remember now Michael telling me, in answer to my query if he thought Lizbeth had a Brownie camera, that he didn't know that- but that he knew of- and had seen "snapshots" of Lizbeth. There was one of a picnic with her servants and their little girl. He said there were lots of snapshots with her in them, and these were not posed portraits, either!
I asked if there was cine film of her to his knowledge but he didn't know- but that they had unearthed footage of Florenece Brigham from the 1920's!

Thanks for letting us see things from your side of the lights, Stef. I just know your presentation was wonderful and I wish I could have been there!

It's fascinating hearing from everyone about their experiences and seeing all the photos -- and thank you, Eugene, for the picture of the newly painted house. I was so hoping someone would share that!

Looking at Stefani's avatar made me think of all the people who are intrigued by Marilyn Monroe much in the same way as we are intrigued by Lizzie Borden. But they are so much luckier than we are. There is such a wealth of information, pictures, and film on Marilyn -- whereas we are starved for details and images of Lizzie.

I respect and admire the reticence of Fall River -- but sometimes I wish they weren't quite so circumspect. How amazing would it be to see those unposed 'snapshots' of Miss Lizbeth Borden?

Just a thought-having done a Lizzie lecture several years ago here in Boston (Thanks to Stefani) I can imagine how nervous I would have been in Fall River!
I actually had to use an old slide projector-("ca-chink!ca-chink!" sounded every few minutes. And I was stiff, staying safe behind my podium)
Stefani's presentation was professional, the graphics were state of the art, her mein was easy and fun, she walked up and down the room, making eye contact with everyone, and cracking jokes, and it was clear that she knew and loved her subject matter well. I so wish I had that kind of rapport!

Thanks for your impressions, Stef. Interesting stuff. Kat, did Michael say whether those snapshots are in private hands or part of the FRHS collection? Would I ever love to see those!

Stef,
take it from a true FallRiverite who has heard many speeches, presentations and what have you about Lizzie and the Borden case, You were FANTASTIC!

The first thing that my wife said to me when your lecture was over was " Wow, it's that late already?". They say time flies when your having fun. I really enjoyed it. I know my wife and daughter did too. You had my Hannah cracking up on occasion. Your adlibbing not only adds to the presentation but lightens the mood and makes the listeners feel more relaxed. I know it did for me anyway and I noticed how you move about the room not unlike a politician or socilaite. Thats a good thing. You didn't stand at the projector robotically clicking from one scene to the next explaining in a monotone voice. You flowed, you enlightened, you joked, you explained, you connected! You go girl!
Please give yourself 2 pats on the back and several "atta-girls".
As far as Fall River opening up it's closets or attics for that matter and revealing a new found wealth of Lizzie Photos and other goodies, I wouldn't hold my breath.
I know it's out there. I'd bet money on it but it's just the way people are in Fall River. It's hard to explain but Len Rebello knew exactly what I was talking about when I mentioned it to him. People around here would rather not let anyone know that they have an unseen photo of Lizzie or Bridget or anything else for that matter. It's just the way they are.
Why don't we place an ad in the Fall River Hearld news or team up with them to start a contest to find a new Lizzie Photo? You might think that in this day and age of E-bay and the like, you would see Lizzie related items that people would want to make some money from but that's not the case. The only items you do see are photos that look nothing like Lizzie or books that once belonged to Lizzzie because they have LAB scribbled in pencil inside the front cover.

That's an interesting idea, Mark!
Yes, you'd think...in this day and age...

Edisto, to reply, MM was referring to citizen's private caches.
He sees stuff come in, is asked about it, gives his opnion or not, and watches it leave. He says it's really hard to watch it leave.

Pooh, that is a depressing idea that there is a wealth of Lizzie related paraphernalia out there that just sits and sits and sits. I wonder what their reservations are that they don't want the stuff in the public eye?

The worst is when it sits in a collection, unmarked. Then, if the owner dies or becomes incapacitated, the person left to tend to it has absolutely no idea of what they possess!
Advice to all: get your parents, grandparents, etc. to identify all the photos in the family album before it's too late! (Same goes for an object with an interesting history.)

You've got a good point.
I had my mother identify quite a few people in old photos before she passed away.
It was a moving experience for us both, and interesting and educational, and it preserved the identities.
She enjoyed it.

I was "forced" to ID a lot of my old photos (many inherited from my Mother) for a long-lost family member who suddenly reappeared a couple of years ago and wanted to know everything about the family. It was a real epiphany for me. I couldn't just slap on a label that said "Marcia Muckenfuss," but I had to explain who Marcia is.
(Yes, I really do have a relative by that name, although I believe she's fortunate enough to have married young and taken her husband's surname. Whatever it is, it's gotta be an improvement over "Muckenfuss.")

At least Marcia has the grace not to hyphenate her last name!

Stef's lecture was fantastic! (I couldn't tell if she was sweating, either.) I could hear her just fine - and my hearing is on the fritz. I did notice people starting to put on sweaters like it was too cold in there. I thought that was why that great air conditioner was turned off.

I hope she gets to lecture there again. I would think she would be a most welcome and requested speaker. Totally professional, makes you feel like she's having a conversation with you, funny, cute!, and a total joy. THANK YOU, STEF, FOR GIVING US YOUR BEST. I didn't want it to end, and I don't particularly like "lectures". This was no lecture. It was like a chat with someone who knew a lot of interesting things, and you kind of lost track that it was a one-sided deal.

I always thought there had to be more pictures of Lizzie. "She liked to have her picture taken" I read long ago. So where are they, I thought. And she loved her pets - there has to be some out there with her pets in them.

That's a great idea, Mark, to see if a contest could be held to bring out new Lizzie photos. You so smart!

The first time I went out to FR, which was before the murder house was a B & B, the city kept Lizzie under wraps pretty tight. When it was realized what she could do for the town monetarily it started to be more acceptable. She made the cover of a visitor's brochure! That was a big break. Some steps along the way weren't easy. I remember when they had to get permission to put an axe on a sign for the B & B, I think it was.

The people that turn out for these Lizzie things - the re-inactment, Stef's lecture, etc., are just a fraction of the persons that are able to get to Fall River in person that have an interest in the case. Some people are interested, but they don't know they can go to Fall River and see the house, the FRHS and read "The Hatchet". The word is spreading, though.

I hadn't heard that Michael had seen other Lizzie photos. That would have driven me nuts when the person walked away with them.

People not coming forward with their Lizzie stuff (and I agree there are many) reminds me of shortly after the murders, when Lizzie had sent a letter to one of her girlfriends she was to meet in Marion. And the 'girl' refused to hand it over to the police. That was out of loyalty to Lizzie, I think. There are still people today who are loyal to her, trickle-downs from their grand-ancestors.

That's scary to think people might have something and don't realize it.

A few years ago on eBay, someone was selling a letter signed by Governor George D. Robinson - not about the Lizzie case, but still signed by him - for ten bucks. I emailed him and told him what he had there and who Governor Robinson was. I coulda bought it for the $10. But I felt that would be somehow dishonest.

I'll betcha Lizzie's on film somewhere - or was and the film got ruined in an attic. If she liked her photo taken, I'd think she would find it hard to resist a moving picture of her taken.

That's neat, hearing Lizzie was gardening. I never heard of her doing that. Another piece of her character falling into place. We'll find more - eventually.

I forgot to compliment Tina-Kate on her cartoons!
Stef commissioned two original cartoons to help illustrate transitions in her talk and they were SO amazing!
Thanks TK!