Lizzie Borden Society Forum

I'm trying to choose some music to put into my Lizzie documentary and I keep waffling between getting composers to do original music, or finding music that would have been from Lizzie's time.

Even if it's original music, it should sound evocative of the 1890s, for example acoustic piano music instead of electronic.

For music of the time, I got a two disk set of music recorded in the 1890s, but its a lot of "pop" music and band music, nothing that sounds appropriate for Lizzie. The quality of the early wax recordings are predictably poor.

Does anyone here have any opinion on what type of music would be appropriate for Lizzie? Did Lizzie herself prefer any particular type of music. For all her love of the theater, did she also go to concerts? Did she have a penchant for classical? did she like Gilbert and Sullivan? Was there any hint she liked opera?

How do you feel about minimal piano music?

I think the music is going to be crucial in such a film so I want to do this correctly.

I agree about the music being crucial. I was just telling Stef that was my opinion of indie videos about 3 days ago!

The Villisca video (about an axe murder) had haunting music, sounded original, but Stef would know. The thing is, when they wanted to break away from the story to show the context of the times in the rest of America, they switched to something akin to Scott Joplin. I didn't like it. There was no transition. They used the music to make a transition but it was too jarring a switch. I mean, they had me- you know-?- then Joplin-esque music. Then back to the moody music. It broke my fantasy trip to Villisca.

I'm not saying they didn't draw me back again, and I'm no expert, but that seemed too *obvious* to me. I felt manipulated.

The bridge was out (literally in this case.) Is that what you mean, Kat?

I think Scott Joplin may have been too obvious. There seems to be a wide range of music to choose from, but I want to find what fits the mood not only of Lizzie's world, but of the approach I'm taking in the documentary. I figured I would do the murder with the crime scene photographs with no music, but the rest of the film I would like some piano based theme that would exemplify how I feel about Lizzie.

Here's a bit from Wikipedia about popular music in 1892

* "After the Ball" w.m. Charles K. Harris
* "The Bowery" w. Charles H. Hoyt m. Percy Gaunt
* "Daddy Wouldn't Buy Me A Bow-Wow" w.m. Joseph Tabrar
* "Daisy Bell" (aka "A Bicycle Built For Two") w.m. Harry Dacre
* "Flanagan" w.m. C. W. Murphy & William Letters
* "Future Mrs. 'Awkins" by Albert Chevalier
* "The Holy City" w. Frederick Edward Weatherly m. Stephen Adams
* "La Sultana Turkish March" m. Fred Linden
* "Liebestraum Nocturne" m. Virginia Field
* "Molly And I And The Baby" w.m. Harry Kennedy
* "My Old Dutch" w. Albert Chevalier m. Charles Ingle
* "My Sweetheart's The Man In The Moon" w.m. James Thornton
* "The Sweetest Story Ever Told" w.m. R. M. Stults
* "The Virginia Skedaddle" w.m. Monroe H. Rosenfeld

I'm trying to find a recording of After The Ball because it sounds like it may have a place in the film. The lyrics are quite melancholy and evocative of a sad loss in 1892.

AFTER THE BALL

A little maiden climbed an old man’s knees—
Begged for a story: "Do uncle, please!
Why are you single, why live alone?
Have you no babies, have you no home?"
"I had a sweetheart, years, years ago,
Where she is now, pet, you will soon know;
List to the story, I’ll tell it all:
I believed her faithless after the ball.“
”Bright lights were flashing in the grand ballroom,
Softly the music playing sweet tunes.
There came my sweetheart, my love, my own,
‘I wish some water; leave me alone.’
When I returned, dear, there stood a man
Kissing my sweetheart as lovers can.
Down fell the glass, pet, broken, that’s all—
Just as my heart was after the ball.“
”Long years have passed, child, I have never wed,
True to my lost love though she is dead.
She tried to tell me, tried to explain—
I would not listen, pleadings were vain.
One day a letter came from that man;
He was her brother, the letter ran.
That’s why I’m lonely, no home at all—
I broke her heart, pet, after the ball."

Chorus:

After the ball is over, after the break of morn,
After the dancers' leaving, after the stars are gone,
Many a heart is aching, if you could read them all—
Many the hopes that have vanished after the ball.

This link only has a clip of "After the Ball", but it might just be what the doctor ordered.

http://www.emusic.com/album/10586/10586 ... fsrc=spire

Track 9, button to the left triggers a 30 second preview. The vocalist is quite pleasing to the ear.

Thanks Richard, that was good.

My grandmother used to sing me to sleep with "After the Ball is Over". There are a couple of different melody lines for the song floating out there in Googleland -- but this link plays the tune she sang to me.

http://wilstar.com/midi/after-the-ball-is-over.htm

Unfortunately it's one of those 'now playing' sites -- so I'm not sure if it's always playing "After the Ball". It has a crawler across the top that tells you if it is, though.

Music is so important to a production, isn't it? It's really worth taking the time to get just the right sound.

It's still playing, as of now.

My grandmother used to sing to me: "Ke-Ke-Ke-Katy..."

I recently returned from California and visited Knotts Berry Farm. One of the stores in the theme park sold CD's of music from an old music box. There must have been 8-9 different ones. Some were modern, some classical and others old. I purchased one. But the huge table-top music box had a unique sound and sold for $12K. The CD's were $16.95. The sound would be really cool for your documentary. Also harpsichord music would sound great along with the old piano sound.

Richard: you might want to consider some of Victor Herbert's music as well. He not only composed many tuneful operettas and familiar melodies. but also wrote "programme music" (marches, suites, etc) also.

Here's another possibility, Richard. I think it's from 1900. It's an entirely different situation, but there are lines that resonate with Lizzie's.

Bird in a Guilded Cage
(Arthur J. Lamb and Harry Von Tilzer)

The ballroom was filled with fashion's throng,
It shone with a thousand lights;
And there was a woman who passed along,
The fairest of all the sights.
A girl to her lover then softly sighed,
"There's riches at her command."
"But she married for wealth, not for love," he cried!
"Though she lives in a mansion grand."

cho: "She's only a bird in a gilded cage,
A beautiful sight to see.
You may think she's happy and free from care,
She's not, though she seems to be.
'Tis sad when you think of her wasted life
For youth cannot mate with age;
And her beauty was sold for an old man's gold,
She's a bird in a gilded cage."

I stood in a churchyard just at eve,
When sunset adorned the west;
And looked at the people who'd come to grieve
For loved ones now laid at rcst.
A tall marble monument marked the grave
Of one who'd been fashion's queen;
And I thought, "She is happier here at rest,
Than to have people say when seen: "


The last verse is especially eerie in that context!

--Lyddie

I dreamt I Dwelt in Marble Halls is a haunting melody and lyric- shades of Maplecroft to come. Scorcese used it in The Age of Innocence to great effect. Here's the midi and lyrics.
http://www.smickandsmodoo.com/lyrics/marble.htm

This song was written by M. W. Balfe (1808-1870). Michael W. Balfe managed the Lyceum Theatre (then known as Theatre Royal, English Opera) in 1841

I was watching a new DVD the other nite on an American Victorian subject. It was filled with Ragtime. It was appropriate for my DVD. But I agree with Kat. It's just not Lizzie background music. If at all, I would use a little to set the stage and portray the feel of the 1890's.

Yes - the antique music box songs would probably be very good. I have a tape of some, but they're all Xmas carols. That might get grating after a while - all that tinny sound. But it would be good to use here and there.

The theme song from "The Legend of Lizzie Borden" movie was haunting. They had childrens' voices like from far away in the past and incorporated the "...took an axe..." poem. And some song that was dainty and 1890-ish. Now why did that work so well?

I don't think I would use lyrics that refer to a lover. It could be misleading. A pretty tune that is not well known, tho, and contains the word but it's not sung would be okay.

I loved the song Shelley posted! As far as I know, it's not real well known today. It was worth considering.

"After the Ball" is a good song. But it's well known. A lot of people will know it by its title. It's a dance song - a waltz. To me, it makes me think of a big ball with people dancing. Myself, I don't see a connection with Lizzie.

Have you studied the music in the Lizzie documentaries that are available? I can't recall if they used music or not in them.

augusta @ Mon Aug 21, 2006 1:40 pm wrote:
"After the Ball" is a good song. But it's well known. A lot of people will know it by its title. It's a dance song - a waltz. To me, it makes me think of a big ball with people dancing. Myself, I don't see a connection with Lizzie.

You’re right, Augusta. We do tend to think primarily of Lizzie living a fairly narrow existence but (and just to be contrary, you understand) I'm presenting this scrap of possible evidence that at least one morning she woke up ‘After the Ball Is Over’.

Military Ball
A Notable Gathering of Society People
Costumes of the Ladies --- Persons in Attendance

Much that has been said about the success of the social events under the auspices of Company M must be said over again. Tuesday night the annual military ball was held in Music hall and it was a very gay affair. The committee of arrangements had done everything to make the occasion of the high standard attained by previous events of a like kind, and it succeeded very well. The committee consisted of Capt. S.L. Braley, Lieut. J.D. Munroe, Lieut. David Fuller, Sgt. W.F. Borden, Corp. Durfee, Privs. Abbott, Davol, Harrison, McCoy and Sanford. The platform was decorated with palms and other tropicals, and festoons of similar hung over the windows. . . .

. . . There were 54 couples in the march, and the brightly glittering gold braid of the officers and the spick and span uniforms of the soldiers contrasted very beautifully with the lighter stuffs worn by the ladies, and made a spectacle from the gallery very pleasing. Not one half of the dancers present took part in the march, as there were probably 125 couples on the floor at one time or another during the evening. the programme, a very recently printed folder from the press of J.D. Munroe, contained 16 numbers in all as follows: march, waltz, quadrille, polka, quadrille, military schottische, Saratoga lanciers, medley quadrille, gilde polka, waltz, quadrille, lanciers, waltz quadrille, polka, waltz and medley quadrille. Besides these, there were several encores and extras which kept up the dancing until considerably after midnight. . . .

. . .All the ladies present were tastefully dressed, but there were not a dozen who were in full evening dress. Possibly the most noticable costume was one of baby blue tulle worn by Miss Hattie Jackson of Boston who, with Miss Kittie Abbott of Boston, was under the chaperonage of Mrs. Dr. J.H. Abbott. Miss Jackson's dress was cut dancing length, with sleeveless corsage, decollette, with a garniture of pink roses. She wore a sash of pink surah; pearl necklace and aigret of pink roses. . . .

. . . Among the people present not previously mentioned were Dr. C.C. Terry and wife, A.B. Bruneau, Nathan Davol, Miss Annie Luther, Miss McKenney, C.S. Merrill, John Ainsworth, Miss M. Freeborn, Charles Campbell, Miss Ida Palmer, Mr. and Mrs. William Simmons, Mr. and Mrs. Andrew Whitehead, William Crossley, Miss Crossley, Miss Hattie Harrision, Miss Ella Smith, James McKeop, James McDermott, Miss Annie Horsfield, James Bruck, John Hughes, the Misses McLeod, Walter Burgess, John Booth, Laura McQuitty, Miss L. Stevenson, Thomas Pitt, Miss Mamie Nicholson, Will Nicholson, Miss Bella Connell, Miss Nellie Collins, John F. Allen, Miss M. O'Mears, Mrs. N.O. Adams, Charles Anderson, Mrs. J. Colemen, Mrs. S. Munroe, John Gormely and wife, R.E. McGuire, Miss M. O'Gara, James Smith, Miss Lizzie Borden, and W.H. Hargrave.

Source: Fall River Daily Herald January 15, 1890 (The above is excerpted from a transcription provided by Bruce Laurie, Department of History, University of Massachusetts at Amherst.)