Bridget changing her testimony?

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snokkums
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Bridget changing her testimony?

Post by snokkums »

:shock: I was reading some articles on line and came across this.
It stated the on Bridgets deathbed, she allegedly made a deathbed confession to her sister that she changed her testimony on the stand to protect Lizzie. Does anybody know about this, or heard of it? Is it true, or just a hoax?
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Post by Kat »

Where did you read that? :shock:
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Post by snokkums »

It was an article that I was reading on the internet, and I didn't write down the titile. One of the few times I didn't write the title down. Trying to locate it. Sorry.
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Post by Cheryl »

I've read similar on several sites. Something to the effect that
Bridget admitted that she did not tell the whole truth in order to protect Lizzie. She told this person (name of Minnie something, sister?) that she always liked Lizzie, so she felt a strong desire to protect her. She said that everything she said on the stand was true. Her "lies" were more in the omission of things. I read somewhere that Lizzie was very thankful, and her lawyer even strongly encouraged Bridget to go back to Ireland and stay there. But I don't recall reading that money ever changed hands.
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Post by twinsrwe »

Cheryl, do you recall what site or sites you read this on?
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Post by Harry »

You may have read it on the Curious Books site in Ed Sams' Lizzie Borden: Unlocked". I don't know the exact date when this was published but the bibliography refers to books published in the 1990s.

http://www.curiouschapbooks.com/cntnts.html

The Bridget confession story was originally published in Radin's book in 1961. It was reported in Lincoln 1n 1967 and Brown in 1991. The story has evolved since Radin's original version. This is how Radin reported it:

"The strange episode occurred during Bridget's serious illness in Anaconda when she was stricken with pneumonia and thought she was dying. When Bridget first emigrated from Ireland, she came to this country with a girl friend from her own home town. They separated soon after landing; Bridget settled in New England, and her friend went on to Montana. They corresponded irregularly over the years. The friend married and became Mrs. Minnie Green. Bridget never wrote to her friend about the Borden murders and Mrs. Green did not hear of the case at the time it happened.
When Bridget finally came to Montana and settled in Anaconda, she resumed her friendship with Mrs. Green, who was living in Butte, about twenty-seven miles distant. The friends visited each other but Bridget still did not mention the Borden murders to her childhood companion.
In 1942, when they were both about seventy-five years of age, Mrs. Green received an urgent telephone call from Bridget who said that she was dying, wanted to see her friend, and had a secret she wanted to confide to her before she passed away, Mrs. Green had to make arrangements to get to Anaconda and this took her a little time. When she arrived, Bridget had passed the crisis in her illness and she recovered shortly afterward.
Several days after visiting Bridget, Mrs. Green entered the Butte Public Library.
Miss O'Meara noticed an elderly woman staring at the stacks of books and in obvious need of assistance. The woman hesitantly asked if the library had any books on real murders, and when she learned there were quite a few, asked if anything had been written on the Lizzie Borden case. She told the librarian how Bridget had sent for her and related what occurred during her visit to Anaconda. While the principals were alive, Miss O'Meara never revealed the story; she did not even tell anybody that Bridget Sullivan was living in the area. Since both Bridget and Mrs. Green were dead, she consented in 1960 to tell me the details.
Mrs. Green told Miss O'Meara that Bridget had informed her old friend for the first time that she had been a witness in the Borden case. Bridget said that her testimony was favorable to Lizzie who, to show her gratitude, had given her money to visit her parents in Ireland, and added that the Borden lawyer had advised her to remain in Ireland and never return to the United States. Bridget said she bought a farm for her parents and stocked it with horses, cows, pigs, chickens and sheep. Later, Bridget said, she became restless, obtained a passport under another name and returned to this country, going to Anaconda. Mrs. Green said that Bridget told her she was fond of Lizzie and frequently took her part in family disputes. Bridget also said she had testified only to the truth at the trial.
Mrs. Green, who had known Bridget since they, were children, was frankly skeptical of her friend's story. She failed to find anything in it to account for Bridget's urgent demand that she rush to her bedside because she wanted to confide something to her before she died. Mrs. Green borrowed several books on the case from the library and, returned them several days afterward. When Miss O'Meara asked if she had learned anything, the older woman shook her head, looked puzzled, and left. As far as Miss O'Meara knows, she never came to the library again. Bridget recovered and moved to Butte. Whether the two old friends saw each other after this episode is also unknown.
Believers in Lizzie's guilt can seize upon this incident to bolster their claim that Bridget withheld information and was paid off by Lizzie. It also would help substantiate the stories about her return to Ireland with a lot of money. Bridget's statement to Mrs. Green is the only evidence that she may have gone back for a time. Bridget still had relatives living in Fall River after the trial and could have heard from them what was being said about her.
There are many reasons to be skeptical of the story Bridget told Mrs. Green. As Mrs. Green realized, Bridget had really said nothing which could explain why she had asked an elderly friend to hurry to her bedside. Her claim that she interjected herself into family disputes to side with Lizzie is unbelievable. So is her insistence that she told only the truth at the trial. And despite what she told Mrs. Green, her trial testimony, as has been shown, was anything but favorable to Lizzie. There are also serious discrepancies in her testimony concerning that vital half hour of time unaccounted for on the morning of the murders. One can only speculate as to what Bridget might have told Mrs. Green had she still thought she was dying when her friend finally arrived."

I know of no evidence that Bridget was paid off. I agree with Radin - there are many reasons to be skeptical of this story,
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Post by Cheryl »

Yes...read it on CuriousChapbooks.com (lizzie borden unlocked);
there it definitely discusses the probability of money changing hands.

Also perused other sites that mentioned a near death-bed confession...www.straightdope.com and crimelibrary to name a couple.
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Post by twinsrwe »

Thanks, Harry. I also agree with Radin. IMO, the books by Lincoln and especially Brown are not reliable sources.
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Post by twinsrwe »

Thanks, Cheryl, for posting your source.
In remembrance of my beloved son:
"Vaya Con Dios" (Spanish for: "Go with God"), by Anne Murray ( https://tinyurl.com/y8nvqqx9 )
“God has you in heaven, but I have you in my heart.” ~ TobyMac (https://tinyurl.com/rakc5nd )
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Post by twinsrwe »

I found a couple of sites, which contain the statement: Sullivan allegedly gave a deathbed confession to her sister, stating that she had changed her testimony on the stand in order to protect Lizzie.

The first site is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridget_Sullivan
The second site is: http://www.answers.com/topic/bridget-sullivan

Robin/snokkums, is either one of the above links, the site you found this statement in?

If, so, it is a well known fact that the information in Wikipedia is not always an accurate and reliable source, because anyone can submit anything they want, with or without listing a source. Granted, there are sources listed in the Wikipedia.org site, regarding this article, however, we don't know if this statement was submitted by the original author who may have or may not have listed the source, or if it was added in by someone else who did or did not list a source. It is always a good idea to confirm anything you find in Wikipedia. Unfortunately, I don't have any of the sources mentioned, so I can't confirm anything.

In the second site I listed - please note the following statement which you can find just below the list of sources: This entry is from Wikipedia, the leading user-contributed encyclopedia. It may not have been reviewed by professional editors (see full disclaimer)

Check out the full disclaimer, in part, it states: ... Wikipedia cannot guarantee the validity of the information found here.
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Post by Kat »

Thanks you guys! And thanks Harry for the in-depth transcription!

I had read that, of course, but a sister to Bridget Sullivan I had not ever heard, ever! :shock:
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Post by snokkums »

It was on the site http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/bridget sullivan. I had just remebering if there was any truth to the statement because of where it came from. Thanks.
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Post by Kat »

Looks like Wiki says "to her sister" after all!

Harry, did you look at the O'Dwyer reference?

You guys who read Wiki- if there are sources given, don't hestitate to check those- it will help you in your research! :smile:
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Post by Harry »

The April 1996 edition of the Lizzie Borden Quarterly contains the article on Bridget Sullivan's family. It was written by Riobard O'Dwyer in collaboration with then LBQ editor, Maynard F. Bertolet.

According to that article it was not Bridget's sister whom she went to live with but her niece:

"Following this terrifying experience, she left Fall River and circa 1896 moved to Anaconda, Montana, nearby Butte, and became a part of the Allihies Mines community in residence, Bridget married a Smelterman named John E. Sullivan who died in 1939. Shortly after John's death, she moved in with her niece, Mrs. Mary (Bantry Tim) Sullivan at 112 East Wilman Street in Butte, Montana. ..."

The confusion may have originated in another article in the 1995 Fall/Winter edition of the LBQ in an article by George Quigley. He wrote:

"The woman tracked to Anaconda and Butte, Montana may be the wrong Bridget Sullivan. They may have found several Bridget Sullivans, and assumed they were all one and the same, ignoring the many discrepancies of their own "documentations."
The search to find the real Borden maid, Bridget Sullivan, seems to be like the search for the proverbial needle in the haystack.
Alas, the Bridget Sullivan track to Montana could be the wrong Bridget. In 1897 hundreds of Bridget Sullivans were listed as residing in the area of Butte, Montana ... several being about 27 in 1893.
What is truly amazing is the hundred-plus years since the double murders occurred, no one has probed the family of Bridget Sullivan - the number one witness for the prosecution, although it was documented she had relatives in Fall River, Newport, Ireland, Pennsylvania, and Montana.
Yes, Montana. She did indeed leave Fall River after the verdict and travel west to Montana. She never returned to Ireland. She initially lived with her siblings in "The Big Sky Country". She married a man named Sullivan - but not John. She lived on a farm until her death, and she never bore any children."

But note that he says she lived with her "siblings" before she was married not at the time of her death.

I am inclined to believe Mr. O'Dwyer. With the exception of the year of her birth which he claims was 1864. I accept the year as 1866 making her 26 at the time of the murders which is what she testified to.
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Post by Kat »

Thanks for that Harry! :smile:

I wonder if Quigley knows for sure there were Bridget's sibling(s) there in Montana.
She must have gone there for some reason

Down here I always ask people how they ended up in Florida. Most often the reason is they had a family member or friend already here.
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Post by 1bigsteve »

snokkums @ Sun Sep 09, 2007 8:44 am wrote:It was an article that I was reading on the internet, and I didn't write down the titile. One of the few times I didn't write the title down. Trying to locate it. Sorry.

What I do, Snokks, when I come across a web page that I like, if I can't "save it" in My Documents is add it to my Favorites lists. I can always write it down later but at least I captured it. I have all of my Favorite links stashed within various folders like, Lizzie, Cars, Auctions, Maps, Fun Sites, Movies and TV, etc., for easy finding. Same way with My Documents. That way I never have to wonder where that site was located. Makes net life so much easier.

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Post by Allen »

I remembered reading that Bridget had family in South Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. I wonder if these family members could've migrated to Montana also?

The Witness Statements page 21, from the notes of Officer Harrington's interview of Bridget on October 1, 1892.

"I think I will try to get a place here, through Mrs. McKenney's Agency; if not, I may go to Newport R.I. and work in the hotel where I was employed before. I have relatives in So. Bethlehem, and as I worked there before, I may go again."
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