If Bridget would have gone shopping

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 11:38 am

I got to thinking about something,and I probably wouldn't have thought much about this if Lizzies' parents hadn't had been murdered. But I thought it was kind of odd that Lizzie seemed to be trying to get Bridget out of the house by making a mention of a sale on dress goods. Possibly trying to rid herself of a witness, maybe. I mean, if Lizzie did kill her parents, she might not know which way Bridget would go, either support her or go against her.

1bigsteve · Post by **1bigsteve** » Sun Jun 08, 2008 9:41 pm

To my way of thinking, Snokks, Lizzie's attempt to get Bridget out of the house is a sign that Lizzie was probably in on the killings and needed Bridget out of the house so there would not be any witnesses for her father's upcoming demise. But, when Bridget went upstairs Lizzie probably saw that as the best opportunity she was going to get of riding herself of the only witness.

-1bigsteve (o:

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:57 am

If it was Lizzie, then I think if she couldn't get Bridget out of the scene she might have felt she had to whack her too.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:00 am

Yes, indeed. What a mercy Bridget liked to catch 40 winks before lunch if she could. That probably saved her life. I love reading Bridget's testimony about why she went upstairs- to "tidy her room", etc. She seemed to be taking pains not to give the impression that she was having a siesta on her employer's time. Finally, it becomes clear she was actually napping, after she is closely questioned. Still, she says she had all her clothing on and her shoes, which makes it seem she was ready to go back to work in just a few minutes, and was not a lazy lump.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:30 am

I don't think it was so odd that Lizzie mentioned a sale on dress goods to Bridget; what I find odd is the time of day Lizzie mentioned the sale to Bridget. The sale on dress goods was mentioned to Bridget just before the noon meal and it was Bridget's job to prepare the meals. Did Lizzie really expect Bridget to drop everything right then and there to run off for a sale on dress goods?

I far as I know, Lizzie did not mention if Bridget should go shopping for the dress goods before or after the noon meal. If Lizzie had indeed told Bridget to go shopping before preparing the noon meal, then it would not only have put a great deal of suspicion on Lizzie herself, it would have been a red flag for Bridget. I think Lizzie was smarter than that.

Bridget may not have known who the killer was the day of the murders, but I believe she figured out who the killer was, or at least suspected who the killer was, shortly thereafter. Perhaps Bridget put two and two together after recalling that Lizzie mentioned the dress goods sale before the noon meal. Something caused Bridget to leave the house on second street, for good, shortly after the murders.

Lizzie's mention of the dress goods sale to Bridget may have been a completely innocent comment on Lizzie's part.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:46 am

That is an excellent point. There was not much to do before the meal, only soup to heat up and cold mutton and bread,- so Bridget did not actually have to cook much. But she still would have had to heat the stove up, add things to the table which was already set, and maybe slice the meat. It takes about 12 minutes to walk up to North Main Street to Sargent's (which is now next to the Library), plus 12 minutes to return home-plus shopping time. So had Bridget gone before lunch, leaving at 11, she would barely have had time to get the food on the table.
Yes, I agree, Bridget was shook up when Andrew was found, but I think when she saw Mrs. Borden on the floor- that did the trick-she was a goner then!
What I do not quite understand is that the ad says the sale is FRIDAY- not Thursday.

1bigsteve · Post by **1bigsteve** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:17 am

Very good point, Judy. If Lizzie had mentioned that sale on any other day it would have looked completely innocent and perhaps it was a completely innocent remark on this day also.

Heres an idea. Perhaps Lizzie had in mind to suggest that Bridget go ahead and go into town and Lizzie would take care of preparing the noon meal? After all, who was going to "jump" on Lizzie for suggesting that? Her parents? They would already be dead. But, when Bridget said she was going up to her (third floor) room perhaps Lizzie felt that was good enough and didn't push any "go into town now" idea Lizzie may have had. Once Bridget was upstairs and out of ear-shot, whack, whack, whack!

I know from personal experience that cleaning windows on a hot day is very hard, tiring work. Perhaps Lizzie figured, "Who could blame me for suggesting that Bridget take a much needed break after doing such a fine job on the windows in this summer heat? After all, I'm a nice thoughtful person."

But, perhaps Lizzie was going to suggest that Bridget go into town later that day or the next. Maybe the mention of the sale had nothing to do with the killings and Lizzie had no idea what was happening. On the other hand maybe Lizzie's brain was in over-drive and she was coldly calculating how she was going to pull this one off.

-1bigsteve (o:

SallyG · Post by **SallyG** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:28 pm

That newspaper ad about the sale was obviously in Wednesdays paper, since the ad says TOMORROW, Friday...as in TOMORROW (Thursday) and Friday (the next day). I don't think they meant to say Tomorrow, Friday as in Tomorrow, which would be Friday.

I think Lizzies mention of the sale was to get rid of Bridget. I doubt she expected her to dart out immediately to the sale..but who knows, she may have.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:38 pm

Shelley @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:46 am wrote:That is an excellent point.

Thanks, Shelley.

Shelley @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:46 am wrote:... There was not much to do before the meal, only soup to heat up and cold mutton and bread,- so Bridget did not actually have to cook much. But she still would have had to heat the stove up, add things to the table which was already set, and maybe slice the meat. It takes about 12 minutes to walk up to North Main Street to Sargent's (which is now next to the Library), plus 12 minutes to return home-plus shopping time. So had Bridget gone before lunch, leaving at 11, she would barely have had time to get the food on the table.

That's right. It is also possible that the trip to Sargent's would have taken her longer since Bridget was not feeling well that morning.

Shelley @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:46 am wrote:... What I do not quite understand is that the ad says the sale is FRIDAY- not Thursday.

I'd forgotten the sale was advertised for Friday!!! So, maybe Lizzie was simply mentioning the dress goods sale to Bridget so that she could plan on going to the sale on Friday, if she so desired.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:40 pm

1bigsteve @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:17 am wrote:Very good point, Judy.

Thanks, Steve.

1bigsteve @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:17 am wrote:... Heres an idea. Perhaps Lizzie had in mind to suggest that Bridget go ahead and go into town and Lizzie would take care of preparing the noon meal? After all, who was going to "jump" on Lizzie for suggesting that? Her parents? They would already be dead. But, when Bridget said she was going up to her (third floor) room perhaps Lizzie felt that was good enough and didn't push any "go into town now" idea Lizzie may have had. Once Bridget was upstairs and out of ear-shot, whack, whack, whack! ...

I can't see Lizzie offering to prepare the noon meal so that Bridget could go to a sale which was to take place the next day. Actually, I can't see Lizzie offering to prepare any meal, since Bridget was getting paid to prepare the meals.

1bigsteve @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:17 am wrote:... I know from personal experience that cleaning windows on a hot day is very hard, tiring work. Perhaps Lizzie figured, "Who could blame me for suggesting that Bridget take a much needed break after doing such a fine job on the windows in this summer heat? After all, I'm a nice thoughtful person." ...

I agree, that washing windows on a hot day is very hard and tiring work, but do you really believe Lizzie made such a suggestion, and that she was that nice and that thougfhtful??? I don't know, Steve, I certainly have doubts about this. If Lizzie was the real killer, then she was not a nice person.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:41 pm

Now that I have been reminded (thanks to Shelley) that the sale was not until Friday, I have a feeling that Lizzie's mention of the dress goods sale to Bridget on Thursday was nothing more than a completely innocent comment on her part. I sure wish I had been a fly on the wall the day of the murders!!!

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:59 pm

twinsrwe @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:41 pm wrote: I sure wish I had been a fly on the wall the day of the murders!!!

Nah--you would have been too occupied with that mutton stew to notice anything.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 1:01 pm

SallyG @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:28 am wrote:That newspaper ad about the sale was obviously in Wednesdays paper, since the ad says TOMORROW, Friday...as in TOMORROW (Thursday) and Friday (the next day). I don't think they meant to say Tomorrow, Friday as in Tomorrow, which would be Friday. ...

I don't see where it is obvious that this ad was in Wednesday paper. If the sale was for Thursday and Friday, then wouldn't there have been a dash (-) placed between the words TOMORROW and FRIDAY instead of a comma or the word 'and' placed the two words?

Shelley, do you happen to have the date this ad was in the paper?

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 1:09 pm

Angel @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:59 am wrote:...Nah--you would have been too occupied with that mutton stew to notice anything.

Good one, Ellen!!! You know me quite well, don't you? Hey, if there is food anywhere this side of La, La Land - I'm there!!!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 3:28 pm

I will look up the date when I am in FR Friday, on this newspaper ad. I recall we had some discussion on this somewhere before. Andrew took the Providence Journal, and this is the Herald, so I wonder how and when Lizzie learned of this sale on Friday? It is also possible that she mistook the day and thought the sale was on Thursday if she had not seen this ad. She might have learned about it from overhearing it in town (perhaps while out and about shopping Wednesday morning down at Smith's! )

Of course, I have always harbored the little notion that this dress sale was to be Lizzie's alibi for where she was when Abby died -and just MAYBE the deaths of Abby and Andrew had to be pushed back to Thursday for a very good reason. When everything happened a day sooner, of necessity, the first thought to get Bridget out of the house was the dress sale because Lizzie had planned this before.

I also suspect there is a VERY important little piece of critical information that we are missing and may never get to find out, which would illuminate in a blinding flash, the little connections we always struggle over.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 7:37 pm

Shelley @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:28 pm wrote:I will look up the date when I am in FR Friday, on this newspaper ad...

Thanks, Shelley. I think it may be helpful to know the date the ad was in the paper.

Shelley @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:28 pm wrote:... I also suspect there is a VERY important little piece of critical information that we are missing and may never get to find out, which would illuminate in a blinding flash, the little connections we always struggle over.

I agree, I have always thought there is a missing piece of information that is critical to this case.

Susan · Post by **Susan** » Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:50 pm

I can't find it for the life of me, but, does anyone know what Bridget's work schedule was? I think she got off the whole day Sunday and she had a half day one of the days of the week? Could it be possible that Thursday was Bridget's half day and Lizzie had meant for Bridget to attend the sale after her work day was through?

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:37 am

Susan @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 7:50 pm wrote:... Could it be possible that Thursday was Bridget's half day and Lizzie had meant for Bridget to attend the sale after her work day was through?

I was wondering the same thing, Susan. I may be wrong, but I also thought Thursday afternoon was Bridget's half day off; I have also been trying to find this information. If Sally is correct about the sale being both Thursday and Friday, then it is possible Lizzie meant for Bridget to go shopping after the noon meal.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:07 am

Well, this is a very important point to settle. It has always cast Lizzie in a very incriminating light to suggest the sale when she did- it really makes it look like she was trying to get Bridget out of the house. If there is a possible innocent spin on this- then it is important in the big scheme of things to pin it down as an option. It would make sense- Bridget was finished with the work on the windows, the meal was already planned, this was the time of day Bridget usually tried to slip in a rest before lunch- so to offer the suggestion of a little shopping sale would not have been suspicious.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:56 am

You're right, Shelley - it is not a suspicious suggestion if the sale was indeed to take place on Thursday and Friday.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:21 am

Per Rebello, p183:

"Note: Bridget had testified at the preliminary hearing that Lizzie told her about a sale of dress goods at Sargent's Dry Goods Store for 8 cents a yard. Lizzie denied that she made the statement. However, there was no advertisement in the Evening News that a sale was taking place. The ad appeared in the evening edition on August 4th. Lizzie's lawyers said she may have predicted the sale."

The image of the sale notice (sorry, I don't know the paper but undoubtedly a FR one) mentions the sale as being on Friday. This would tie in with Mr. Rebello's note above that it was in an evening edition on Thursday.

Better hurry, Bridget, "A rush is expected."

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:59 am

Yes, I recall now that there was some discussion of the ad being in the evening paper- FR had the Herald and another daily- was it the Globe? I am not sure when the evening paper came out- probably after noon sometime. In any event the big and pressing question was- HOW did Lizzie know about it at 11 on Thursday morning unless somebody had told her about it, or else she heard about it in the stores earlier in the week. Both clippings above from the newspaper are from THURSDAY papers, saying Tomorrow, Friday- there was the sale. It would have done Bridget no good on Thursday to go to the sale which had not happened yet. A sticky business- yes?

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:10 am

Even more sticky in that Bridget said Lizzie had never told her of sales before. She said Emma had but not Lizzie.

The sale included Bedford Cords. Lizzie could have used some to replace that burned dress.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:33 am

I was thinking maybe Jennings suggested to her that her mention of the dress sale would have the effect it has on all of us now- namely that it looked fishy and that Lizzie was trying to get Bridget out of the house. Emma had been away for over 10 days and I never could see how Emma would have known anything about the Sargent's sale at all from her perch in New Bedford.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:42 am

I believe Bridget's reference to Emma was about prior sales not the one at Sargent's on the 5th.

From the Prelim (p81):

"Q. Did she ever tell you about any sale at Sargeants before this particular day?
A. No Sir.
Q. It is the first time she ever mentioned it?
A. Yes Sir.
Q. About any chance of buying any?
A. Yes sir. Emma had a good many times told me about bargains.
Q. Miss Lizzie had not before, so far as you recollect?
A. No Sir.
Q. What did you do next?
A. I went up stairs directly after that."

It really does cast suspicion on Lizzie. Lizzie may have known the sale was to be on Friday but still told Bridget anyway to send her on a wild goose chase out of the house.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 10:51 am

Yes, it does seem to look darker rather than lighter for old Lizzie. Emma comes off looking a little kinder though- at least she bothers to try to help Bridget who had a slender purse.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 12:22 pm

Thanks, for the reference from Rebello, Harry. Wow, this puts a whole different light on things, doesn't it? This piece of information makes Lizzie appears more guilty than ever. I think if I had been in Bridget's shoes on the morning of the 4th, this simple suggestion coming via Lizzie would definitely have been a red flag, especially since Lizzie had never told her of sales before. However, since Bridget was not feeling very well that morning, she may not have picked up on a red flag, that is, not until later when recalling Lizzie's suggestion.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 12:25 pm

Harry @ Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:42 am wrote:... It really does cast suspicion on Lizzie. Lizzie may have known the sale was to be on Friday but still told Bridget anyway to send her on a wild goose chase out of the house.

Funny you should say this, Harry. I was just thinking that it is a possibly that Lizzie didn't know anything about the sale on Friday- she just told Bridget there was a sale to get her out of the house and hoped Bridget would take her word for it and go out on a wild goose chase. The ad in the newspaper on Thursday may have been a coincidence; than again maybe Lizzie did hear about the sale when she was out shopping earlier that week.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 12:27 pm

Yes, you always have to allow one coincidence- I think even Sherlock Holmes says something to that effect. Besides, there's always bound to be a sale somewhere! Chances were good-and Lizzie could always say she was mistaken about WHICH store.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 2:24 pm

That's a good point, Shelley. I wonder what Bridget thought of Lizzie's 'kind' suggestion, being it was the first and only time Lizzie ever gave her information regarding a sale on anything.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 2:45 pm

Well, the fact that Emma tried to tell Bridget whenever there was a sale tells me Bridget must have loved a sale and liked to shop. If Lizzie were trying to get rid of Bridget- that might be a good ploy to try on her. If this was an unusual kindness, then I tend to agree with Hiram Harrington- that's the first time we've ever seen ole Lizzie bend over backwards to show human kindness to her household inhabitants!

Yes, it is in the tiny little details about everyday life that the truth will be found out.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:53 pm

Shelley, a note just to say I'm sorry. When I posted the picture of the Sargent's ad I didn't know you had already posted it a few threads back. I should have looked at prior screens.

BTW, had a battle yesterday with a kidney stone. Luckily today all is okay. Scary though.

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:58 pm

Opps- AOL at its finest....

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:58 pm

No worries, mate- I thought maybe it was from a different paper. Stoned again, eh Harry? Well, we should form an elite club. The buggers don't hurt unless they move around. I am now on the oxalate-free diet which eliminates just about everything worth eating. Sigh. . . drink plenty of water! And citrus stuff. Hey, here's a thought- maybe Lizzie was having a kidney stone attack, went off her rocker with pain and didn't remember a thing. Believe me, the pain is so bad, you'd love to murder something!

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:30 pm

You may be right about Bridget loving sales, Shelley, although, I wonder if she found sales were an absolute necessary part of her life due to the amount her salary. We know that Bridget was not feeling well, the day of the murders, but, I think if she really loved sales and shopping, she would not have let her sickness stop her from getting in on a bargain.

I also think that if the suggestion of a sale on Lizzie's part was actually an act of kindness toward Bridget, then she is definitely showing a side of herself that is not the usual Lizzie we know. However, I can see Emma faithfully being kind to Bridget in this way, although, I believe Emma had a much darker side to her personality than Lizzie did.

Shelley @ Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:45 pm wrote:... Yes, it is in the tiny little details about everyday life that the truth will be found out.

You've got that right.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:31 pm

Harry @ Tue Jun 10, 2008 2:53 pm wrote:... BTW, had a battle yesterday with a kidney stone. Luckily today all is okay. Scary though.

I'm sorry you had such a bad day yesterday, Harry. Glad you are feeling better today. I have not had one, but I hear they are extremely painful.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:35 pm

Shelley @ Tue Jun 10, 2008 2:58 pm wrote:... Hey, here's a thought- maybe Lizzie was having a kidney stone attack, went off her rocker with pain and didn't remember a thing. Believe me, the pain is so bad, you'd love to murder something!

Oh my, now that is a thought!!! I've hear other people, who have had kidney stones, say they don't wish them on their worst enemy.

Allen · Post by **Allen** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:40 pm

I am also very sorry to hear about your painful ordeal Harry. I have an aunt who had kidney stones and required the electroshock/shockwave therapy (I've heard people call it both which is correct term?). She said she would never go through that again. I can't say I know anything about the level of pain, but Shelley's idea could be plausible.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:08 pm

Thank you, ladies for the sympathy. It's appreciated. Tried not to take anything for it but ended up taking some strong pain medicine left over from the last attack.

All is well now. Just hope it stays that way.

Nadzieja · Post by **Nadzieja** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:12 pm

Harry, Hope you stay well. Being in that type of pain is just awful, you just don't know where to put yourself to be comfortable. May you never get stoned again!!!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Tue Jun 10, 2008 9:22 pm

Lithotripsy is the best thing. If the stone is still there, it can start squirming around again. Breaking the nasty bugger up is the way to finally get rid of it. I had 2 laser surgeries (and a lithotripsy, and 2 stents) 2 weeks ago to blast the two which got stuck-what an awful business that was. Am taking something called Theralith which was recommended by my urologists. It is a vitamin supplement high in magnesium citrate and B6 and potassium- all help to keep stone producers like us from making stones. You do not need a prescription for this- I get it straight from the company for 35 bucks! . The success rate is phenomenal! http://www.theralogix.com/theralith.shtml
This and a diet list of no-no foods, plus a lot more fluid daily, rich in citrus juices and water, will make a huge difference. It's so darned expensive to have stones (my bills have just topped 22,000 from the last episode) that I have to get serious about prevention measures.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:58 am

I have a copy of the ad that Harry showed. It has no date on it, nor newspaper.
Earlier it was remarked that it says "Tomorrow, [comma] Friday."
I do believe they are correct in that that might mean 2 different days, meaning Thursday and Friday, but printed Wednesday.
I seem to recall hearing that ad had come out Wednesday after all- but can't prove that now so don't rely on that, please.
Shelley's ad has no date or paper cited either.

Now as to Bridget- don't we hear her changing her story a couple of times as to what she was doing upstairs? I wonder why this is taken so lightly- like something almost charming or endearing about Bridget, yet Lizzie is usually castigated for changing stories?
We should remember that Lizzie said that Bridget went upstairs even before Andrew came home. And Lizzie says she didn't tell Bridget of a sale.
So we choose who we believe, but not everyone believes Bridget in everything she says. Just to be fair to Lizzie.

Kat · Post by **Kat** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:11 am

Snokkums, you start some pretty interesting topics! Thanks!

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:53 am

I think Bridget is easy to understand. All those eyes and ears are upon her in court, probably for the first time in her life. She wants to make a good impression and give a good account of herself and actions. She is reluctant to repeat just what it was she said when she could not open the front door. She puts a good "face" on what she was doing, going up to her bedroom in the middle of the day, changing from tidying her room to finally admitting to lying down for a snooze.
Makes me wonder just how long she did gab to the Kelly's maid too. Funny, when you are "on the stand"- it's natural for one to wish that the court finds you a hardworking, ambitious, conscientious citizen- and in 1890, ladylike could be added to that list.
Think of how it would impress people if she had said, "Well, I had to do those bloody windows, and I had just upchucked in the back yard too after that stinking breakfast of old mutton. But I decided I would skip the kitc hen windows, then I saw my chum Mary, and we had a good long gab out by the fence. Then I threw some water up on the windows and gave it a once-over with a brush, and trotted inside to give the insides a lick and a promise when the old man came home. The $^#**&^% door was stuck and my hands were wet so I let loose with a few choice words. I could hardly wait to scamper off to my room and crash on the bed- what a helluva hot, miserable morning!" Yes- sometimes it is better to gild the truth a bit.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:28 pm

Kat @ Wed Jun 11, 2008 1:58 am wrote:I have a copy of the ad that Harry showed. It has no date on it, nor newspaper.
Earlier it was remarked that it says "Tomorrow, [comma] Friday."
I do believe they are correct in that that might mean 2 different days, meaning Thursday and Friday, but printed Wednesday.
I seem to recall hearing that ad had come out Wednesday after all- but can't prove that now so don't rely on that, please.
Shelley's ad has no date or paper cited either. ...

Well, obviously people are reading this ad two different ways - I am still reading it as meaning the sale was on Friday, only. Granted everyone is entitled to their opinions, however, I tend to put a great deal of faith in what Mr. Rebello states in his book; Harry, posted the following taken from Mr. Rebello's book which states the ad appeared in the evening edition on August 4th. So, are you saying that Mr. Rebello's information may be incorrect?

Harry @ Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:21 am wrote:Per Rebello, p183:

"Note: Bridget had testified at the preliminary hearing that Lizzie told her about a sale of dress goods at Sargent's Dry Goods Store for 8 cents a yard. Lizzie denied that she made the statement. However, there was no advertisement in the Evening News that a sale was taking place. The ad appeared in the evening edition on August 4th. Lizzie's lawyers said she may have predicted the sale." ...

Shelley, would you be so kind as to look up the date of this ad next time you are in Fall River?

Shelley · Post by **Shelley** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:42 pm

Can do- I had planned to waddle on over to the library before I go to Oak Grove.

I always wondered why this issue of the sale was not looked into more thoroughly. I bet if women had been on the bench - it would have! Maybe the answer is simply that it HAD been advertised for awhile and Lizzie could have seen or heard about it earlier that week. Thing is- it would have to have been Monday or Tuesday, unless Alice told her about it Wed. night. It would not have been in the Providence paper which was the one which came to #92.

twinsrwe · Post by **twinsrwe** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 1:21 pm

Thanks, Shelley - I think it is time we got this issue cleared up. I will look forward to hearing what you find out.

There are several possibilities as to how Lizzie knew about this sale before it was printed in the paper.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:42 pm

Angel @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:57 am wrote:If it was Lizzie, then I think if she couldn't get Bridget out of the scene she might have felt she had to whack her too.

Lizzie might have thought that Bridget go out if she hadn't seen her go up to her bedroom.

snokkums · Post by **snokkums** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:43 pm

Angel @ Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:57 am wrote:If it was Lizzie, then I think if she couldn't get Bridget out of the scene she might have felt she had to whack her too.

Lizzie might have thought that Bridget go out if she hadn't seen her go up to her bedroom.

1bigsteve · Post by **1bigsteve** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:58 pm

Harry @ Tue Jun 10, 2008 5:08 pm wrote:Thank you, ladies for the sympathy. It's appreciated. Tried not to take anything for it but ended up taking some strong pain medicine left over from the last attack.

All is well now. Just hope it stays that way.

Harry, been there done that!!!

When I had mine I got into the shower and let the hot water hit the kidney. The excruciating pain was gone instantly. I don't know why but it worked twice. I got into the shower because I thought the hot water would ease the "pulled muscle" I thought I had. It turned out to be a kidney stone instead. The hot water must have done something to get the stone moving because it dropped into my bladder and it came out a week later. Fortunately it was small. Give the hot water a try next time. It may give you some needed relief.

Glad to hear you are feeling better.

-1bigsteve (o: