Some changes on Second Street

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:44 pm

This photo of Second Street (year?) shows two objects. The one near the Borden house may be a police or fire call box. Or maybe something else.

Is the one on the other side of the street near the Bowen/Miller house a light pole?

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 12:21 am

Yes Harry..............

What a great photograph. I love old photos. Not for their esthetic value, but for the images frozen in time. Like the suspender pants fellow walking South. Where is he going? Who is he? What sort of life did he live? How did he die? Who loved him......who did he love.

Wonderful Photo.

The post on the right is most definitely a light post.

I'm not so sure about the one near the Borden house. I doubt that it is a fire call box. (?) If it is it has it's top missing. Also, it is to thin to be a fire box pedestal. Most were on the same side as the telegraph poles from which they were fed. Understand, I may be wrong? But!!!!!

What it probably is is a hitching post for tying up your horse. The top attachment, which is usually the shape of a horses head, looks like it may be missing.

It is right in front of the Churchill House, better known as the Buffington House, the first or second mayor of FAll River. (There were two Buffingtons. The second and fifth mayor was also named buffington, both the same fellow.)

It would make sense that the mayor's house would have a hitching post out front, or at least you would think so.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:39 am

Yes, below are a couple of 19th and post 19th century fire call boxes. Usually fire boxes were red and police boxes were blue. Most of these boxes were placed on the corner of a block.

As you can see Harry, most of these boxes had much beefier bases.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:46 am

Below is a Horse hitching post. I am sure many of us have seen these. Some of these could be beheaded and the head removed.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:50 am

Yes. Having said what I have, and going through all the trouble of trying to prove myself............it could still be a call box base. I just don't think it is. If it is in fact a call box base, the top is missing.

None-the-less, nice one Harry!!

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 8:43 am

Thanks for the photos and input. MB. Love the horse heads!

I magnified the object in front of the Churchill house and unless I'm seeing things (like they saw with Martian canals) I see a circular object atop of the post:

If it is there it is almost certainly a fire alarm call box. This post card shows a very similar object near the Central Cong. Church:

The city directories list the locations of the fire department call boxes. Both the listing in 1892 (pages 670-671) and the 1896 list (pages 752-753) show a box at the corner of Rock and Franklin where the church is located.

Angel · Post by **Angel** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:31 am

mbhenty @ Tue Dec 29, 2009 12:21 am wrote:Yes Harry..............

What a great photograph. I love old photos. Not for their esthetic value, but for the images frozen in time. Like the suspender pants fellow walking South. Where is he going? Who is he? What sort of life did he live? How did he die? Who loved him......who did he love.Wonderful Photo.:

I feel the same about old photos, and I wonder the same thing about the people and the houses. Especially some of the pictures of the people in the Ellis Island photos. Absolutely fascinating.

SteveS. · Post by **SteveS.** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 9:32 am

The object itself (minus the round top) is exactly shaped like the object in front of the Central Cong. Church which still has its round top. Harry says the church one is listed where a fire call box should be. I am with MB tho in that the police and fire call boxes I remember growing up in Fall River had more of a thick base and a square top (red for fire, blue for police) and were almost always placed at corners and intersections. That object could very well be a predecessor of the boxes you and I remember MB. If it is a fire box, it's kind of ironic that they placed it in front of the Churchill house instead of at a corner especialy considering that the Churchill house would eventualy be destroyed by fire. I would tend to think it was a hitching post except it does have the exact same shape base as the object near the church. I am going to have to do some research on this now. You guys got my curiousity peaked. I was always under the assumption that the call boxes I remember as a kid in Fall River were the original ones first placed by the city and they didn't look like that object at the base.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:17 pm

The 1900 City Directory (page 919) lists a fire alarm call box at "Borden, cor. Second". That entry does not appear in the 1898 listing. The 1899 listing was not available.

I kinda believe they would list a call box's location at the nearest intersection if it was not on a corner. The one in front of Mrs. Churchills may very well be that box.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 5:52 pm

Yes Harry: It could very well be. My only doubt about it being a hitching post is that its a little thick for that.

If you may be so kind as to allow me to dim the lights a little on your analysis.

What we perceive as a box (round) on top of the pedestal is probably one of the columns from the fence in front of the Borden house. There are two posts, one on each side of the Borden driveway. The one on the left, as you face the building, has it's ornate cap missing. This makes it look like it is part of the suppose call box. But in fact, I think there is no top to the call box, if in fact that is what it is.

Also, that pedestal and the one across from the CC Church are totally different. I colored the photos below in my attempt to enhance them. Much is lost once you blow-them-up.

I remember police boxes still in service, (or at least still in place) like the one in front of the CC Church. They were Police Call Boxes and one needed a key to access them. They were blue. This was back in the 1960's. ( which would make me about 35 years old

)

One more point.

If this was in fact a police call box, why would Officer Allen not use it rather than job all the way back to the police station? This would mean that it was a fire box or a defunct police box.
(?)

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 6:35 pm

Partial quote:

mbhenty @ Tue Dec 29, 2009 5:52 pm wrote:
One more point.

If this was in fact a police call box, why would Officer Allen not use it rather than job all the way back to the police station? This would mean that it was a fire box or a defunct police box.
(?)

Whatever it is, it was not there in 1892. There was a fire call box on Second St. in 1892 but at the corner of Branch St. a considerable distance.

What a shame the directories don't show the locations of the police call boxes.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Tue Dec 29, 2009 7:10 pm

Found this post I made in May 2007 in the archives:

"When Kat and I were in Fall River last week we stopped at the library for a little research. I stumbled across a book called "1892 Fall River City Documents". It was one of a series by year. The purpose of the book was to record the various reports of the city departments for the year 1892. I looked at the report of City Marshal Hilliard and found this about the police signals:

"The police signal system is working well. One new box was added to the system, making the total number of boxes sixty-eight."

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:23 am

Yes, in the Eighties I was actively involved in the installation and repair of the lines which feed fire boxes. Though similar to call boxes, these were used to report a fire. Most were placed inside buildings such as mills and schools, public buildings, etc. My responsibility was to make connections between a panel at the fire department and right up to the fire call box. The fire department would then make connections inside the box and at the fire station panel.

The boxes used were similar to the one the fire person is holding below. Most were being removed around the time I left the trade. Now, what they use is similar to a Burglar Alarm Panel, but much more complicated; connected to sprinkler systems, etc.

People like you and I..........if we have a fire we must run down the street screaming, "THEATER, THEATER."

Most of the street police call boxes were removed before I remember. (Probably sometime in the 60s) I guess for every police car they purchased, and every beat cop they pulled off the street, they could retire a box or two.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:30 am

Hey Harry. I was mistaken.

That is not a light post across the street.

Its a hitching post for tall horses. The light is so you can see at night when you tie your reins.

Ok, ok......it's getting late and I'm goofy. I'm off to bed.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:36 am

Yes Angel. I feel the same. That is why I collected post cards. My favorite were the ones with people in them.

Many collectors liked their cards clean, with no writing.

I preferred them as used. I love reading the correspondence. Most of it is small talk, about the weather, the trip they are on, or just to say hello. Some were love notes. One in my collection a gal makes it plain to her man that it is now or never. Not sure what she meant, but I can guess.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:43 am

Yes SteveS, I don't know if you ever seen one. But, I remember hitching iron rings that were driven right into the granite curbing by the side of the road in fall river. Not sure if any still exist?

Similar to the one below.

SteveS. · Post by **SteveS.** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:17 am

Yes I do remember them MB. I remember asking my father what they were for because at that time Lincoln Park used to have the "rings" on the merry go round that is now sitting at Battleship Cove. If a child reached over far enough off the merry go round and grabbed a ring he won a prize. I can't imagine the liability today of having children reach way over off a moving ride. Well anyways.....thats what I used to think of when i saw those rings in the granite. I also do remember the old police and fire boxes with a key. I remember one standing on the corner of South Main and Dwelly St. This was way back in the early 1960's. The boxes were allready old then, not sure what year they were installed though. They were extremely thick, heavy looking cast iron boxes.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:07 pm

Yes Harry: Though you may feel a tinge of regret that you started this thread, I am afraid you will need to bear it a little longer.

Below is an interesting shot, a blow up of a larger image. It is of the Women's Union Building, across the street from the CC Church, just one block up the road from the police box you posted on the corner of Bank and Rock. The one displayed below is of a fire box. The one on the corner of bank is a police box. Both, a block away from each other. The fire box is on the corner of Franklin and Rock.

The other photo is taken from a famous, or should I say familiar, fall river post card. The building with the columns in the rear are of the First Cong. Church. In the foreground are two call boxes, just a couple of feet from each other; one a fire, the other a police.

Cool, huh Harry. Or perhaps annoying, considering I love kicking a dead horse.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Wed Dec 30, 2009 2:15 pm

Hey, just saw that horse move. Let's kick it some more.

Here are a couple more.

One is of the mills on Pleasant Street. Notice the box on the left. OOPS, I mean on the right.

The other is of a box across the street from the YMCA Building on North Main Street, the corner of Pine. It looks like a square police box. Also notice what looks like hitching poles below it. There looks like there are two of them? Connected all as one, post and Box? Interesting.

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Fri Jan 29, 2010 7:10 pm

Ok Harry. I stumbled upon another photo with the same post in it. As a matter of fact, two of them, several feet apart.

The photo below is taken from Phillips History of fall river, Vol. III post page 41.

(Looking at the photo it would place you on North Main Street somewhere around the old Durfee Theater. The big building in the foreground to the right is the old Granite Block Building. Today this is directly across the street from the existing city hall, where the world flags are displayed today)

I have posted the photo below with 2 blow ups.

If you look closely you can see an exact pole, pedestal, just like the one on Second Street.......as a matter of fact two of them.

This photo was taken around 1857. In the distance you can see that the Academy Building, has yet to be built.

Since this was 1857 we can count out police and fire boxes since they were yet to be invented.

.......................................................................................................

I think I know what they are.

They are called Carriage Bollards, or Traffic Bollards. Their job is to keep carriages off the sidewalk or away from the gutter. Some were placed around corners to prevent carriages from cutting the corner to tight and mounting the walkway. Also, they were placed in front of public houses or public buildings to keep carriages off the walkway etc.

At least, from what research I have done, I think that is what they were.

Problem solved???????

mbhenty · Post by **mbhenty** » Fri Jan 29, 2010 7:15 pm

Here are a couple of English Bollards.

SteveS. · Post by **SteveS.** » Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:57 pm

By George! I think you got it MB. I recall seeing something just like that when I was a kid but I don't recall where in the city I saw it.

Stefani · Post by **Stefani** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:36 am

Great sleuthing Mbhenty!!! I agree with Steve S.

You have solved it! Bravo!

DJ · Post by DJ » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:19 pm

Was looking at the photo-- interesting to note the sash in the guest-room window is part way up, and the window itself appears raised a bit.

Meanwhile, the sash in the parlor window below is pulled down completely. Did the parlor generally remain in darkness? Know that would have helped the upholstery, rug, etc. from sunlight fading.

Surely the sashes were up (for light) and the windows raised (for ventilation) on the a.m. of the Fourth, when Abby was preparing the bed.

As for hitching posts, all the old ones I've seen (namely, in New Orleans) have horses' heads, with rings in the horses' mouths. Don't know if that was a universal thing in cities, but the presence of the horse's head would leave no doubt as to the purpose of the post.

Harry · Post by **Harry** » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:43 pm

Yes, good Sherlocking, mb. That's a strong possibility.

It appears to line up with the Churchill/Borden property line. It's hard to tell from the angle but that's close enough. Now why would they put one there?

Maybe they were afraid of Hyman Lubinski careening down Second St. looking for customers and not looking where he is going?